Problem with totally positive dog trainer

  • Problem with totally positive dog trainer

    Posted by Ally on October 27, 2021 at 12:28 AM

    I’ve done a lot of dog training in the past, and when my husband got back from the military he needed some extra help. I got an 8 week old puppy and trained her as a service dog for my husband. She did great! She got her CGC at 6 months old, even won some ribbons in competitive obedience & rally at 8 months old. Now, she’s 1 & 1/2 and can do pretty accurate medical alerting for him. The problem is she’s not certified, she does not have her public access test passed because I don’t know how to find someone to just test her. Everyone that does the CGC public access test around me does totally positive dog training & wants that done first. But, I just needed someone to test her and it didn’t feel right/honest to try and test her myself. I went with one of these trainers to get my dog certified, which made her go to her puppy class and work up from the beginning again. I got chewed out about using any prong collars and crates. My dog was bored out of her mind and started shutting down in the class. When I have her out in public or at home she does great! Can I please get some help. I just want someone to test my dog & I’ve done a lot of training with her. When in the positive dog class she shuts down and I got this today about my dog:

    *dog behaviorally shut down/non-responsive entire class

    *Dog has not improved overall since coming into program believed to be due to conflicting training methods

    *showed up on prong collar to woofstock

    *believe dog cannot be effectively task trained because performing behavior with initiative has been punished out

    *Have come to class on prong collar (this has not happened again since it was addressed but at the time we told them not to use one at all and they appear to be still using one)

    Ally replied 2 years, 5 months ago 3 Members · 3 Replies
  • 3 Replies
  • Ed

    Member
    October 27, 2021 at 4:09 AM

    That is strange. I would be very interested in what Robert and others have to say. Perhaps you submit the question via the AMA form. We use different training methods and different tools all the time and the dogs are cool with it. For general behavior we are balanced. For agility we are clicker and mostly positive. The only thing I can think is if you are doing the “homework” balanced and then when in class doing positive. That I think would not work. So, like us, for example, the agility training is clicker based, so all our training for agility at home is also clicker. Could that be the issue? BTW the trainer wanting to start from zero sounds like either he/she wanted the extra money, or was emotionally vested in teaching __you__ a lesson — from his/her perspective, of course.

  • Riggan

    Member
    October 27, 2021 at 7:26 AM

    Ally,

    First of all, I used to train service dogs, so I do understand the laws regarding this topic. To be very clear, there is no legal requirement for certification or public access testing of any type. I personally believe that these are well worth doing for owner-trainers just to get an outside perspective on your dog’s suitability, but it is not a requirement. (One caveat here: it may be required in your state for SD-in-training. Once the dog is trained, however, the ADI supercedes any such state level requirement.)

    I would strongly suggest that you look at the International Association of Assistance Dog Partners (IAADP) and Assistance Dogs International (ADI) websites if you haven’t done so already. There are a variety of published Public Access Tests for Service Dogs on the Internet. Here is a link to one of them: https://www.psychdogpartners.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/2017-Public-Access-Test.pdf. You can use any of these or combine them to create your own version. Just make sure that you don’t ignore areas that may be a bit weaker for your dog. Ignore any comments about not allowing prong collars. This test is for YOUR information. No one can legally deny your husband access because he is not “certified.” Do you have a trainer or knowledgeable person that you trust who has not been involved in the dog’s training? Enlist this person to the be “examiner” and then go to a public place to conduct the test. Have them rate the dog’s behavior as honestly as they can. Then adjust any training plans as needed.

    Regarding task training, again, no one needs to determine this except yourself. The dog needs to be specifically trained for at least 3 tasks to mitigate your husband’s disability. Protection and emotional support (ie, benefit just from having a dog with him) are NOT considered valid or appropriate tasks. Medical alert is, as long as the dog has a specific trained alert (which can be a natural behavior such as pawing or nuzzling that has been captured and reinforced to strengthen it and increase the reliability). If you need help regarding other possible trained behaviors, I would be happy to talk with you.

    It sounds like you have done a lovely job with the pup and that she is doing well. Don’t let the trainers you have talked with discourage you as long as you are truly confident that your dog is totally safe in public and that she is able to help your husband. Please thank him for his service for me. Our military men and women (and dogs!) deserve our everlasting appreciation for helping keep us safe and strong in a world that is so uncertain. God bless you both.

    • Ally

      Member
      October 27, 2021 at 4:27 PM

      That is the best info I have gotten all day. Thank-you so much! I will probably take you up on some questions about training other tasks. Your reply as been deeply appreciated!

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